Wow BDSM has a steep learning curve

Mars1991

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ATM it seems more like a learning cliff to be honest, i am a young dominant male (straight) and don't have a lot of experience (well, make that no RL experience).

I spent most of my young life despising what i am, but series of events lead me to accept who i was.

I would like to own a slavegirl in the future(in like 5 years), right now i am in no position to do so due to various factors.

Anyway from my limited previous experience with BDSM i knew that for a Dom a great emphasis is put on competence, and further research only reinforced this conclusion.

So having a timetable i embarked on a general quest for knowledge. And oh boy did i find out how little i knew.

The main issue seems to be how to start, apparently it is a lot easier for submissives, all they have to do is find a good dominant and they are done, for us dominants we have to learn it all on our own.

Also the ratios seem to be skewed rather heavily in towards dominants, as far as i saw there are more often then not 3 or 4 dominants for every submissive.

Nevertheless i am still determined to make it work out for e, an d i am hoping that the next course of action will become apparent as i nspend more time with my own kind.
 

CuriouslyInterested

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Jan 12, 2015
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Read, read, read, read. Then read some more good and bad experiences so you can more easily identify and need be solve problems or know what not do. After you read, remember not everything you read is realistic, this life, not fiction. Meet and talk to all sorts of people. If you have munches in area, go! There a wealth of knowledge to found by simply watching interactions. And remember that no book, person, observation or anything else mandates what must be included or how things should look in your own relationships. It's about what's best for you and your partner, what you enjoy. High protocol, low protocol, whatever. Your relationships are catered to the two of you.
 

Mars1991

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Read, read, read, read. Then read some more good and bad experiences so you can more easily identify and need be solve problems or know what not do. After you read, remember not everything you read is realistic, this life, not fiction. Meet and talk to all sorts of people. If you have munches in area, go! There a wealth of knowledge to found by simply watching interactions. And remember that no book, person, observation or anything else mandates what must be included or how things should look in your own relationships. It's about what's best for you and your partner, what you enjoy. High protocol, low protocol, whatever. Your relationships are catered to the two of you.

Well that's exactly what i have been doing, not really sure about munches to be honest, i never enjoyed crowds, my main problem this days seems to be how to strike a balance in the beginning, i was thinking about searching for an online relationship for some practical experience, but i am not sure when exactly should i start acting like a dom, on one side one thing i see over and over with various subs searching doms is basically "i am not your slave yet so keep civil" but beating around the bush for too long without providing any proof of my dominant nature may cause the potential sub to grow cold and assume i am just a pretender, that's my main dilemma ATM.
 

CuriouslyInterested

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Jan 12, 2015
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i was thinking about searching for an online relationship for some practical experience, but i am not sure when exactly should i start acting like a dom, on one side one thing i see over and over with various subs searching doms is basically "i am not your slave yet so keep civil" but beating around the bush for too long without providing any proof of my dominant nature may cause the potential sub to grow cold and assume i am just a pretender, that's my main dilemma ATM.

In my experiences and observations, a dom doesn't have to bark orders to control a sub. You act like a dom or you do not, there's not a flip to be switched. Subs like to please, to make people happy. Being assertive and "domly" doesn't just happen when you are giving orders. Get to know submissives. If there seems to be mutual interest or a connection, perhaps ask if they'd like to complete a task for you. Show them you are someone who they are safe to submit to. Build a trust.
 

Mars1991

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In my experiences and observations, a dom doesn't have to bark orders to control a sub. You act like a dom or you do not, there's not a flip to be switched. Subs like to please, to make people happy. Being assertive and "domly" doesn't just happen when you are giving orders. Get to know submissives. If there seems to be mutual interest or a connection, perhaps ask if they'd like to complete a task for you. Show them you are someone who they are safe to submit to. Build a trust.

Well i would say there is an inherent difference between barking orders and giving orders, when one says barking orders the first thing that comes to my mind is a jerk sergeant from "full metal jacket", and no, there isn't a switch,but there is a filter. I know for some people BDSM can be rather non sexual but it is not so for me, for me it is inherently sexual. IMO the trust can only be built in small steps, you get someone to give up little control, and then show them you wont abuse this trust. Also, please elaborate more on the whole task thing, it is very important to me for my sub not to do things just to please me, i should mention that submission is not means to an end for me, rather an end in and of itself, i would want my sub to have the same idea and submit because she draws fulfillment from the act.
 

AuthorCrow

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Nov 4, 2016
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Well what I've noticed so far from my current, so far not so big, experience with online subs is, most of them were just girls that have no interest towards submission, but have just contacted me due to the thrill they got over the thought of being controlled by someone (And to be honest, my ad was absolute trash when I first made it so I've asked for it to be entirely removed, and because the ad was so bad, I was only attracting girls that were in it for the thrill as any serious sub would be just "Ah, just another one of those").

As for personal experience, I've had a personal guide for it, my previous Mistress, I knew how she approached it with me; Simple tasks at first, but that's only once certain bond is formed, and that'd be bond based on trust and honesty between the Dominant and the Submissive. If your Submissive wants to instantly jump into tasks and commands, you're most likely dealing with just a person that's in it for a thrill, short-term "submissive" so to speak.
Also, besides the personal guide (As I've only been a sub in person, as well as master in person after I found I preferred being the dominant a lot more), read books about bdsm, read some psychology related books as well, and heads up, they're not easy to process books, so take your time with them and understand, talk with other Dom's and Domme's from this site or from others, how they go at it with their submissive's. So basically what CuriouslyIntereste already have said, read up on experiences of what other Dom's as well as Sub's have experienced. (You'll find most information from reading Subs point of view, when they point out faults in Dom's, sure they're personal for that Sub, but you'll find tons of general mistakes any new Dom does.)
But do note, you're not trying to copy somebody's way of being a Dom, you're trying to get the information on how to approach it and how to recognise to when that trust has been formed (You won't suddenly get a message from your submissive "Hey I trust you now, we can start"). And best advice, start it slow, move from there, and second best advice, proper advertisement.

A bit of tip towards ad:
Put in as much time as you want, ad is supposed to be talking towards that special one or two people among thousands that will read it, so include couple of details, introduce yourself as a person, who you are, maybe what you look like, your hobbies, overall just your vanilla life (But of course, nothing that could get you identified through, unless you don't mind that).
Then explain your way of being a Dom, what are your likes, what you absolutely wont do with your submissive, even if asked, so that'd be your hard limit. Then write down your dislikes.
Overall, there's no such a thing as "too much information", as long as that information has a meaning. and do make Ad interesting to read.

Hope this all helps.
 

Mars1991

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Well what I've noticed so far from my current, so far not so big, experience with online subs is, most of them were just girls that have no interest towards submission, but have just contacted me due to the thrill they got over the thought of being controlled by someone (And to be honest, my ad was absolute trash when I first made it so I've asked for it to be entirely removed, and because the ad was so bad, I was only attracting girls that were in it for the thrill as any serious sub would be just "Ah, just another one of those").

As for personal experience, I've had a personal guide for it, my previous Mistress, I knew how she approached it with me; Simple tasks at first, but that's only once certain bond is formed, and that'd be bond based on trust and honesty between the Dominant and the Submissive. If your Submissive wants to instantly jump into tasks and commands, you're most likely dealing with just a person that's in it for a thrill, short-term "submissive" so to speak.
Also, besides the personal guide (As I've only been a sub in person, as well as master in person after I found I preferred being the dominant a lot more), read books about bdsm, read some psychology related books as well, and heads up, they're not easy to process books, so take your time with them and understand, talk with other Dom's and Domme's from this site or from others, how they go at it with their submissive's. So basically what CuriouslyIntereste already have said, read up on experiences of what other Dom's as well as Sub's have experienced. (You'll find most information from reading Subs point of view, when they point out faults in Dom's, sure they're personal for that Sub, but you'll find tons of general mistakes any new Dom does.)
But do note, you're not trying to copy somebody's way of being a Dom, you're trying to get the information on how to approach it and how to recognise to when that trust has been formed (You won't suddenly get a message from your submissive "Hey I trust you now, we can start"). And best advice, start it slow, move from there, and second best advice, proper advertisement.

A bit of tip towards ad:
Put in as much time as you want, ad is supposed to be talking towards that special one or two people among thousands that will read it, so include couple of details, introduce yourself as a person, who you are, maybe what you look like, your hobbies, overall just your vanilla life (But of course, nothing that could get you identified through, unless you don't mind that).
Then explain your way of being a Dom, what are your likes, what you absolutely wont do with your submissive, even if asked, so that'd be your hard limit. Then write down your dislikes.
Overall, there's no such a thing as "too much information", as long as that information has a meaning. and do make Ad interesting to read.

Hope this all helps.

It does really, but i would like for you to expand upon what you meant when you said you only attracted women who wanted a thrill of being controlled by someone, i thought that was the whole point, or is that just not your thing, or is it that you meant they searched for a short term thrill of a power struggle and had no real intention of submitting, but wanted you to? try to break them?
 

AuthorCrow

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Nov 4, 2016
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What I meant by that is, some girls that live strictly Vanilla life, they'll come across these forums, just to spice their sexual life up a bit that is, so they'll send kik message or gmail message to any post that attracts them or they find it somewhat interesting. Let's face it, getting controlled at some point out of the blue, it's sexually arousing (Guess that's why I even became a sub and was one for a good solid year, but towards that might also have been that I was rather young, as I'm only 21 now and it has been years since it happened.), it gives the rush and keeps it going, but the moment it gets too serious, such girls tend to back out, don't really say they're leaving and just move on from it. Guess you could compare it to one night stands? So what I meant with those type of girls is just girls that aren't really committed to submission, nor are they subs/slaves in the first place, but just introduce themselves as one as it also gives them the thrill by being able to say it.
 

Mars1991

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What I meant by that is, some girls that live strictly Vanilla life, they'll come across these forums, just to spice their sexual life up a bit that is, so they'll send kik message or gmail message to any post that attracts them or they find it somewhat interesting. Let's face it, getting controlled at some point out of the blue, it's sexually arousing (Guess that's why I even became a sub and was one for a good solid year, but towards that might also have been that I was rather young, as I'm only 21 now and it has been years since it happened.), it gives the rush and keeps it going, but the moment it gets too serious, such girls tend to back out, don't really say they're leaving and just move on from it. Guess you could compare it to one night stands? So what I meant with those type of girls is just girls that aren't really committed to submission, nor are they subs/slaves in the first place, but just introduce themselves as one as it also gives them the thrill by being able to say it.

Ah, well personally i don't really have a submissive bone, if i ever had one it was beaten out of me first time i entered male society, i don't like to submit to anyone and would positively hate to have my free will limited, so i could say i am 100% pure dom. Though i would say this women must have a seed of a submissive if they get aroused by the thought of being controlled, does not mean that it will ever blossom into anything and it mainly depends on if that girl decides to pursue it further, but i guess it depends on how you define a sub, as just someone who has a submissive tendency or is something else required too.
 

AuthorCrow

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Well, I was referring to majority of online "subs", I'm not saying every girl is like that, but most that, don't have an account made, jump straight into asking for tasks/dares/commands without trying to get to know you, you having a poorly made ad, it's more than 99% certain that's the type of person you'll get, a "one night stand" of a "submissive".
 

Mars1991

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Well, I was referring to majority of online "subs", I'm not saying every girl is like that, but most that, don't have an account made, jump straight into asking for tasks/dares/commands without trying to get to know you, you having a poorly made ad, it's more than 99% certain that's the type of person you'll get, a "one night stand" of a "submissive".

Well ok, perhaps it would not even be so bad for me to start out with a few such relationships, a serious relationship may not be the best thing for someone of my limited experience, since those are the type of subs that expect serious experienced doms, new subs may be more forgiving of an occasional slip, and if it does not pan out its not so serious since it was casual anyway.
 

AuthorCrow

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Well ok, perhaps it would not even be so bad for me to start out with a few such relationships, a serious relationship may not be the best thing for someone of my limited experience, since those are the type of subs that expect serious experienced doms, new subs may be more forgiving of an occasional slip, and if it does not pan out its not so serious since it was casual anyway.

That's where you're, in my opinion, wrong in a sense, but well, this is where tons of people disagree or agree to what you've just said. Now let me explain as to why.
In my opinion, being new to being a Dom, having couple short term relationships is good indeed, but they still need to be somewhat of a serious dom/sub relationship with a decently serious Sub (and not that type of girls I've described in just recent posts here). As in, with a sub that's new to bdsm scene and not having Dom/Domme's before, but still read about it and is at least knowledgeable about it, so you two both find things out (or to say, you two both find yourselves out as a Dom/Sub), both being new, both taking it slow, and you two actually talking to each other and being honest.
Short-term is meant towards 1-3 weeks long dom/sub relationship with couple of sessions but quite a bit of chatting in between, still getting to know each-other non the less.
But it's non the less somewhat "wrong" as it speeds up the entire thing, it makes it faster, less time to get the feel of each other and less time to actually commit and get to know what both of you want out of it.

But in terms of gathering experience before getting into long term relationship, on how you'd make a start, etc. Sure, they will help, but in my opinion, what CuriouslyIntereste said is still one of the most important and best things non the less, getting knowledgeable about bdsm in general, d/s in general, and then reading through other people's experiences as well as just casually chatting with people, subs, slaves, masters, mistresses, dom's, domme's, etc. and psychology books, mostly towards people's behaviour and whatnot, they all help.
 

Mars1991

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That's where you're, in my opinion, wrong in a sense, but well, this is where tons of people disagree or agree to what you've just said. Now let me explain as to why.
In my opinion, being new to being a Dom, having couple short term relationships is good indeed, but they still need to be somewhat of a serious dom/sub relationship with a decently serious Sub (and not that type of girls I've described in just recent posts here). As in, with a sub that's new to bdsm scene and not having Dom/Domme's before, but still read about it and is at least knowledgeable about it, so you two both find things out (or to say, you two both find yourselves out as a Dom/Sub), both being new, both taking it slow, and you two actually talking to each other and being honest.
Short-term is meant towards 1-3 weeks long dom/sub relationship with couple of sessions but quite a bit of chatting in between, still getting to know each-other non the less.
But it's non the less somewhat "wrong" as it speeds up the entire thing, it makes it faster, less time to get the feel of each other and less time to actually commit and get to know what both of you want out of it.

But in terms of gathering experience before getting into long term relationship, on how you'd make a start, etc. Sure, they will help, but in my opinion, what CuriouslyIntereste said is still one of the most important and best things non the less, getting knowledgeable about bdsm in general, d/s in general, and then reading through other people's experiences as well as just casually chatting with people, subs, slaves, masters, mistresses, dom's, domme's, etc. and psychology books, mostly towards people's behaviour and whatnot, they all help.

Thanks, that is basically my plan ATM.
 

Awesomeffect

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mmm I kinda doubt you still need help on this stuff judging from what curiously and nya have said, but figured I should throw my two cents in as well

Basically I agree with what curiously said if you want info you should read, read, read, and read some more, when I was more active on this site I used to do a very informational blog on fetishes, constructive punishments, and other topics... now I'm not just saying that as a shameless plug, but just trying to let you know that helpful info does exist, I also did one about being a good dom/domme and how to write a good ad, but can't remember if those were on this site...

furthermore, I also agree with nya in that you should try to find a sort of serious relationship(s) at first, even if they are short term, or just a... sub-friend (basically a sex friend but with subs I guess...) though 1 night stands aren't too helpful if you instead find someone who is happy to continue to do sessions with you but can't commit to anything serious this can also be helpful in learning... at the very least it'll help you understand how hectic things can get when you're trying to plan out sessions for a long-term long-distance s&m relationship.

Beyond the previously mentioned bits of advice I'd also highly recommend looking into roleplaying online, though I understand not everyone is into it it's a great way to experience a BDSM session without having to worry so much about stuff like if your sub is ok after asking him/her to do some exhibitionism. Another important thing I'd suggest that may be rather difficult to pull of is to try to get a sub with lots of experience, especially if you're looking for something long-term. In general I think the best way for new dominants and submissives to learn is to pair up with someone with a lot more experienced person that way they can more or less get pointers and understand how to best fit their role. You may be thinking that having a sub give you pointers won't be much help, but in truth the difference between submissive and dominant isn't that big, as such an experienced sub can be rather helpful, at the very least they will be able to tell you either what their ideal dom is like, or what they would do if they were the dom.

I'd also like to say that though reading for information is a good thing, some times no amount of reading will help you learn some things... As such just getting experience is also important... uhm... for instance learning what type of submissive you like the best or best fits your domming style can't necessarily be learnt through reading.

Oh and one final piece of advice, as you seemed to be struggling with this judging from your posts pertaining to figuring out when you are supposed to start acting like a dom... well to be honest I've never really struggled over this... but perhaps that's mostly because I'm more or less a trainer than a classic domme... anyway getting to know your sub is very important and as such letting them know you is also very important. Soooo you need to learn how to make a good ad that gets all the important info out there, tells subs what the minimum required response is, and let's them know a bit about your personality... this is accomplished many ways, but one particularly popular way among doms/dommes is to let them know a bit about your life and schedule plus writing how you normally would talk can be a big help too. As for some advice on getting into things relatively quickly, I usually do 2 things first set up rules I expect the sub to follow within the first 24 hours of accepting them as my sub, this isn't a case of me telling them so much as I propose rules and we work through it together to compromise on things this sort of exercise helps subs bond with doms/dommes, as well as helps them feel more welcomed in that you don't just dictate for them. Second I always do a trial period method where I tell subs you'll be given either x time or x number of sessions, during this period either of us can happily end the relationship for any reason without feeling bad or guilty. Doing this gives subs a sense of security and willingness to do sessions, this is obviously because it gives them an out during this time if they feel uncomfortable or dissatisfied they can leave (of course this only works in online relationships). As for pics/proof I usually won't ask for it during the trial period (assuming they said they'd send it)

Hope it helps sorry if it's long winded
 

Mars1991

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mmm I kinda doubt you still need help on this stuff judging from what curiously and nya have said, but figured I should throw my two cents in as well

Basically I agree with what curiously said if you want info you should read, read, read, and read some more, when I was more active on this site I used to do a very informational blog on fetishes, constructive punishments, and other topics... now I'm not just saying that as a shameless plug, but just trying to let you know that helpful info does exist, I also did one about being a good dom/domme and how to write a good ad, but can't remember if those were on this site...

furthermore, I also agree with nya in that you should try to find a sort of serious relationship(s) at first, even if they are short term, or just a... sub-friend (basically a sex friend but with subs I guess...) though 1 night stands aren't too helpful if you instead find someone who is happy to continue to do sessions with you but can't commit to anything serious this can also be helpful in learning... at the very least it'll help you understand how hectic things can get when you're trying to plan out sessions for a long-term long-distance s&m relationship.

Beyond the previously mentioned bits of advice I'd also highly recommend looking into roleplaying online, though I understand not everyone is into it it's a great way to experience a BDSM session without having to worry so much about stuff like if your sub is ok after asking him/her to do some exhibitionism. Another important thing I'd suggest that may be rather difficult to pull of is to try to get a sub with lots of experience, especially if you're looking for something long-term. In general I think the best way for new dominants and submissives to learn is to pair up with someone with a lot more experienced person that way they can more or less get pointers and understand how to best fit their role. You may be thinking that having a sub give you pointers won't be much help, but in truth the difference between submissive and dominant isn't that big, as such an experienced sub can be rather helpful, at the very least they will be able to tell you either what their ideal dom is like, or what they would do if they were the dom.

I'd also like to say that though reading for information is a good thing, some times no amount of reading will help you learn some things... As such just getting experience is also important... uhm... for instance learning what type of submissive you like the best or best fits your domming style can't necessarily be learnt through reading.

Oh and one final piece of advice, as you seemed to be struggling with this judging from your posts pertaining to figuring out when you are supposed to start acting like a dom... well to be honest I've never really struggled over this... but perhaps that's mostly because I'm more or less a trainer than a classic domme... anyway getting to know your sub is very important and as such letting them know you is also very important. Soooo you need to learn how to make a good ad that gets all the important info out there, tells subs what the minimum required response is, and let's them know a bit about your personality... this is accomplished many ways, but one particularly popular way among doms/dommes is to let them know a bit about your life and schedule plus writing how you normally would talk can be a big help too. As for some advice on getting into things relatively quickly, I usually do 2 things first set up rules I expect the sub to follow within the first 24 hours of accepting them as my sub, this isn't a case of me telling them so much as I propose rules and we work through it together to compromise on things this sort of exercise helps subs bond with doms/dommes, as well as helps them feel more welcomed in that you don't just dictate for them. Second I always do a trial period method where I tell subs you'll be given either x time or x number of sessions, during this period either of us can happily end the relationship for any reason without feeling bad or guilty. Doing this gives subs a sense of security and willingness to do sessions, this is obviously because it gives them an out during this time if they feel uncomfortable or dissatisfied they can leave (of course this only works in online relationships). As for pics/proof I usually won't ask for it during the trial period (assuming they said they'd send it)

Hope it helps sorry if it's long winded

No, not long winded at all, if you have any more info to share, even if it does not fit my particular style of Ds i would still like to hear it, i am very philosophical type of person (i suspect it comes from years upon years of my trying to make sense of my fetishes, for many years i was not even aware there are other people out there with the same feelings) it is interesting to see how other people do it.

I am sad that not more of this forum is dedicated to just discussion, you know, community building (after all our fetishes do inevitably make us outcasts in today's society), but at least there is some, unlike most other forums where all i see is porn fuel. Anyway there is some helpful info in what you said, though reading too much can easily turn into mental masturbation, and i don't want that.

Apart from that, this may not be all that PC but from what i saw i don't think that maledoms and femdoms are really equivalent, there seem to be different driving forces behind them, and different dynamic, though that is just my observation. For my particular style i think i would like it more if a sub offered her submission voluntarily without me having to ask for it, its kinda hard to imagine how it would work out in an online relationship, what with sub having to do all the things to herself and ensure her own safety.

But i would be more likely to set up a situation where basically once we agree on the terms the control is mine, the sub can check out any time she likes (not like i could do anything to stop her anyway) but if she checks out the play-session is over.

The way i see limits is basically there are 3 zones, green zone is the stuff you do on regular basis, yellow zone is the stuff your sub is ok with exploring (boundary pushing) and the red zone is the stuff you never do in any circumstances. As the relationship progresses green and yellow zones may expand but there will always be things you or your sub will never be down with.

I should also mention that i am absolutely not into whips, or paddles or any such things, i know that's basically a staple of BDSM lifestyle, which is exactly why i am not into them. I find them boring, everyone and his mother is doing it, its total clique.

I may consider using them in a strictly utilitarian fashion, if i needed to administer punishment and no other more imaginative way was available, but i would not use them in a session.
 

Awesomeffect

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Dec 10, 2013
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No, not long winded at all, if you have any more info to share, even if it does not fit my particular style of Ds i would still like to hear it, i am very philosophical type of person (i suspect it comes from years upon years of my trying to make sense of my fetishes, for many years i was not even aware there are other people out there with the same feelings) it is interesting to see how other people do it.

I am sad that not more of this forum is dedicated to just discussion, you know, community building (after all our fetishes do inevitably make us outcasts in today's society), but at least there is some, unlike most other forums where all i see is porn fuel. Anyway there is some helpful info in what you said, though reading too much can easily turn into mental masturbation, and i don't want that.

Apart from that, this may not be all that PC but from what i saw i don't think that maledoms and femdoms are really equivalent, there seem to be different driving forces behind them, and different dynamic, though that is just my observation. For my particular style i think i would like it more if a sub offered her submission voluntarily without me having to ask for it, its kinda hard to imagine how it would work out in an online relationship, what with sub having to do all the things to herself and ensure her own safety.

But i would be more likely to set up a situation where basically once we agree on the terms the control is mine, the sub can check out any time she likes (not like i could do anything to stop her anyway) but if she checks out the play-session is over.

The way i see limits is basically there are 3 zones, green zone is the stuff you do on regular basis, yellow zone is the stuff your sub is ok with exploring (boundary pushing) and the red zone is the stuff you never do in any circumstances. As the relationship progresses green and yellow zones may expand but there will always be things you or your sub will never be down with.

I should also mention that i am absolutely not into whips, or paddles or any such things, i know that's basically a staple of BDSM lifestyle, which is exactly why i am not into them. I find them boring, everyone and his mother is doing it, its total clique.

I may consider using them in a strictly utilitarian fashion, if i needed to administer punishment and no other more imaginative way was available, but i would not use them in a session.


mmk I think I understand... mmm I'm a trainer so my domination style is more or less the "I want a sub to be rebellious, but I want her to willingly submit to me after I dominate her" view point and this is just being overly general, I'd also consider myself to be very kind and understanding, but also strict when it comes to rules and punishments. Furthermore, when it comes to what you mean from a dom versus domme viewpoint I honestly don't really understand. Though I would say getting a sub is much harder as a dom if you are straight because there are just soooo many male dominants, but if the domme is bisexual or a lesbian like I am and only takes female slaves then I'd say getting women that want to submit to other women is even harder than finding a girl that wants to submit to a guy. As far as differences in how you have to conduct yourself, none really exist any and all of those are reliant on your personal style, for instance if your a very assertive dominant then you'll probably have a tendency to scare off more people then a dominant that is very calm and supportive. For instance if I had to define what being a domme is to me I'd say it's "to ensure the sub is enjoying him/herself as much as possible" this outlook would have very different results then someone whose outlook is "being a dom means to control my sub".

Equally speaking I believe being a sub means "to please your dominant as much as possible", as apposed to "following any order my dominant gives me". The goal for me is enjoyment and making sure my partner enjoys it while doing this I can ensure that someone won't leave, not by force, but instead by making them literally be happy to stay with me.

Also I should clarify I only allow for a sort of compromise to be made on rules when they are first proposed after that they must be followed without question unless extremely extenuating circumstances occur, such as being hospitalized might get in the way of edging x times a day or something. So I do prefer to have control, but I also think you must be reasonable, and that a relationship requires 2 people to build it not just the one. As for if someone wants to leave they can and their is nothing you can do to stop them... well provided it's online and you don't have pics then yes... but if it's IRL the simple fact you are male might be more than enough to frighten subs into staying now of course I'm not accusing you nor do I think you are that type of person quite the opposite you seem to be rather kind and eager to learn and understand. But not all people happily express their thoughts nor are they very understanding... as such certain assumptions can occur which may or may not lead to accidents or fear. Basically being up front about stuff is very important.

Next up I understand what you mean by limits but you shouldn't really phrase it like that, online they are usually either labled as kinks, dislikes, and limits, or as loves, likes, dislikes, soft limits, and hard limits basically calling something people enjoy doing a limit is a bit confusing and may lead to minor misunderstandings.

Finally it seems your mixing up the public definition of BDSM with what real BDSM is like, though yes whips are a common toy used in BDSM, so is rope (I mean B for bondage right?), but there are generally a few types of subs in vanilla BDSM (excluding personality types of course) they fall into one of three categories: pain, humiliation, or both... from their the categories can be further defined by dividing them into how much the sub actually likes each of the two major fetishes outside of domination, submission, and bondage, used in BDSM... in other words though the whip is very popular in both real and mainstream BDSM it isn't required and if a sub only likes humiliation they would likely honestly opt to never use it. Furthermore, you said the use of it would only be for punishments that you have trouble making inventive, but depending on the sub a good smack to the ass with a whip might be more of a reward then a punishment, and a dominant that rewards a sub instead of punishing him/her can often times end up disappointing the sub. I for instance also hate whips and never use them because personally I think they hurt to much and also I dislike bruising or cutting a sub both of these can happen when a whip is used by someone inexperienced. Finally I also find a whip to be a rather cheap way to administer pain, for instance coming up with an inventive form of nipple torture involving a breast milking machine, some rope, a clothes pin, and a pair of fuzzy dice sounds way more interesting to me
 

Mars1991

Kinky Newbie
  • Straight
  • Male
  • Dominant
Jan 14, 2017
13
0
0
mmk I think I understand... mmm I'm a trainer so my domination style is more or less the "I want a sub to be rebellious, but I want her to willingly submit to me after I dominate her" view point and this is just being overly general, I'd also consider myself to be very kind and understanding, but also strict when it comes to rules and punishments. Furthermore, when it comes to what you mean from a dom versus domme viewpoint I honestly don't really understand. Though I would say getting a sub is much harder as a dom if you are straight because there are just soooo many male dominants, but if the domme is bisexual or a lesbian like I am and only takes female slaves then I'd say getting women that want to submit to other women is even harder than finding a girl that wants to submit to a guy. As far as differences in how you have to conduct yourself, none really exist any and all of those are reliant on your personal style, for instance if your a very assertive dominant then you'll probably have a tendency to scare off more people then a dominant that is very calm and supportive. For instance if I had to define what being a domme is to me I'd say it's "to ensure the sub is enjoying him/herself as much as possible" this outlook would have very different results then someone whose outlook is "being a dom means to control my sub".

Equally speaking I believe being a sub means "to please your dominant as much as possible", as apposed to "following any order my dominant gives me". The goal for me is enjoyment and making sure my partner enjoys it while doing this I can ensure that someone won't leave, not by force, but instead by making them literally be happy to stay with me.

Also I should clarify I only allow for a sort of compromise to be made on rules when they are first proposed after that they must be followed without question unless extremely extenuating circumstances occur, such as being hospitalized might get in the way of edging x times a day or something. So I do prefer to have control, but I also think you must be reasonable, and that a relationship requires 2 people to build it not just the one. As for if someone wants to leave they can and their is nothing you can do to stop them... well provided it's online and you don't have pics then yes... but if it's IRL the simple fact you are male might be more than enough to frighten subs into staying now of course I'm not accusing you nor do I think you are that type of person quite the opposite you seem to be rather kind and eager to learn and understand. But not all people happily express their thoughts nor are they very understanding... as such certain assumptions can occur which may or may not lead to accidents or fear. Basically being up front about stuff is very important.

Next up I understand what you mean by limits but you shouldn't really phrase it like that, online they are usually either labled as kinks, dislikes, and limits, or as loves, likes, dislikes, soft limits, and hard limits basically calling something people enjoy doing a limit is a bit confusing and may lead to minor misunderstandings.

Finally it seems your mixing up the public definition of BDSM with what real BDSM is like, though yes whips are a common toy used in BDSM, so is rope (I mean B for bondage right?), but there are generally a few types of subs in vanilla BDSM (excluding personality types of course) they fall into one of three categories: pain, humiliation, or both... from their the categories can be further defined by dividing them into how much the sub actually likes each of the two major fetishes outside of domination, submission, and bondage, used in BDSM... in other words though the whip is very popular in both real and mainstream BDSM it isn't required and if a sub only likes humiliation they would likely honestly opt to never use it. Furthermore, you said the use of it would only be for punishments that you have trouble making inventive, but depending on the sub a good smack to the ass with a whip might be more of a reward then a punishment, and a dominant that rewards a sub instead of punishing him/her can often times end up disappointing the sub. I for instance also hate whips and never use them because personally I think they hurt to much and also I dislike bruising or cutting a sub both of these can happen when a whip is used by someone inexperienced. Finally I also find a whip to be a rather cheap way to administer pain, for instance coming up with an inventive form of nipple torture involving a breast milking machine, some rope, a clothes pin, and a pair of fuzzy dice sounds way more interesting to me

Thanks for the reply, yes, i see myself as a gentleman, there are some things i just don't do, like for example i would never call my sub things like bitch or whore, i much prefer stuff like slave or little one. I would also never raise my voice, i naturally have rather strong voice (or so they tell me) but i don't yell. As fr rebellious thing, i am rather the opposite, i would like a sub to always submit on her own, that extends to even the simple stuff like bondage and gagging, i enjoy giving orders so in a session would for example tell my sub to put her arms together and extend them so i can tie them up, open her mouth to receive a gag, stuff like that make me really excited, i am not into breaking anyone's will, submission should be a gift freely given.

I don't have so much time right now but i will just add that my screen name was not picked at random, old gods always represented certain ideals and i liked the ideal represented by god Mars (who was unlike the rest of roman pantheon very different from his Greek counterpart).
 

DomW/HEART

Kinky Newbie
  • Straight
  • Female
  • Dominant
Jan 16, 2017
2
0
0
I feel ya' feels like the slope is greased too!

I don't mean to hijack your question, but I am having essentially the same issues wading into this new way of looking at my sex life, but in my situation the Sub actually was just supposed to be a vanilla friend with benefits relationship since I am just 6 months out of a breakup. He's extremely quiet and a control freak in his day to day life, which he has driven me a bit crazy with since we added the benefits to our friendship because he's IMO scared, at first I thought it was simply of "catching feelings" for me, and when he gets spooked (which isn't rare) he just disappears, sometimes for days or even a week or more. Imagine my surprise when in more intimate moments he divulged his fondness for being dominated and wanted me to participate! I was unsure of if I was would even know how or what to do with his "favorite ties", but tried to explain that I wasn't disinterested, but hadn't ever tried it.
I was completely ignorant to any of the intricacies of BDSM, but not averse, it just hadn't really come up, and the imagery of women being dominated so dominates the perceptions of the mainstream that I was just not interested enough to look into it. After he mentioned it again another visit I tried to explain again the information gap, and of course he shut down to my requests for instruction, which after having finally broken down and done considerable reading on the the roles, made sense.
However, as I said I did decide to just do my own research, then I attempted to present my consent to play in the future to him, thinking of course he'd be thrilled, but his response was underwhelming, as I assume is because he wasn't in the "right frame of mind" and trying as usual to control the situation.
Since by my every day interpersonal nature I'm a very nonagressive person, and have "a heart bigger than my chest, I hate to push myself on others in any way I wanted to attempt to have a frank conversation about what he really was looking for, what I was wanting, etc. you know ...the negotiations. He shut down, and insisted I was pushing him to talk after he had told me initially that he wanted a little time to chill since he'd just arrived before getting into "all that". After 3 hours I figured it'd preen enough time to readdress it since I had promised myself I wouldn't indulge him until we had established some ground rules for both of us, not only because that what EVERYTHING I've read so far insists is of paramount importance, and because his way of controlling our time together by not allowing me to know how long he plans on being here, then leaving suddenly in what appears to me as a very empathetic person to be out of panic, that almost always follows sex, which to here him tell it is AMAZING...especially if it is amazing. It's as if the more he likes it the more he fears it, and runs from it. I've been exceptionally tolerant with him because ... I like how amazing he is when we are together , platonically or otherwise, but his disappearing BS makes me crazy. I don't like to wait, I'm not into having to beg someone for their attention, and not knowing what just happened after he leaves, or has disappeared not returned as he told me he would because I get so preoccupied ( I suppose this is akin to the mental masturbation you mentioned you do as well) with everything that happened, going over what might have set him off etc. THIS IS SO NOT COOL, and in any other case would be unacceptable. That being said, I have a bad habit of giving men too many chances when they make me feel good when they are around. To be clear; since this all sounds like things he should either have been just written off for long ago, or should be punished for if we were in a consenting D/s relationship; we haven't had that talk, that meeting of the minds that seems crucial to the entertaining and freeing aspects of the D/s integration and implied vulnerability.
So, when he shut down and tried to leave I convinced him to stay with huge kid gloves, and he eventually just fell asleep in the living room so I gave him an hour and woke him up, which did not go well and I was just like " Let me know when you actually know what you want because if you won't even negotiate with me then there's no point." He reacted as any control freak might picking apart my choice of words questioning my negotiation insistence. So I told him to have a nice day...or week as he walked out the door. Now I'm just irritated at having offered him something he should be excited to hear about even if he isn't excited about the talking part.
Instead he refuses to submit, and as usual is gone when we had planned to spend the day together. Due to my unawareness of his sexual needs until very recently when I've tried to communicate about this as a problem in the past I've expressed my own insecurities triggered by his behavior without being too harsh with accusations and whatnot. I know that he's an extremely private person with everyone, and is very self-loathing, and I'm a natural nurturer so in light of everything I did know (which would be way too long here to enumerate about the circumstances) and that I saw in him as amazing in so many ways, I wanted to help him be more comfortable with me and himself in general, so the thought then of being harsh just seemed mean. I suspect, especially as I write this that he is acting out like a child looking for punishment or at least negative attention, even though his control freak side is emphatic about being sensitive to women who smother and "stalk" (I assumed because of their neediness) and I have ample personal experience dealing with my own stalkers, so I just let the frustrations wear off the best I could trying not to hurt an obviously already wounded soul.
So as much as I just want to say forget it, I'm done with you. I really find him so enticing, especially now knowing that we could have this together. How do I respond to his being extremely disrespectful by ignoring me, or controlling me and my life by his control of his accessibility, then returning as he always does, and usually as if he hadn't left me hanging for days. He's apologized intermittently, and I've friggin' allowed it, which pisses me off. I'm not sure if this is a cry for my attention, just in some way that I don't know how to respond to as a Dom because we haven't actually discussed the scope of his desire for his life being dominated in additon to in bed. Since I'm usually so reserved about forcing my presence or position on others I'm conflicted. I don't want to be so harsh that whatever allows him to be in such control of everything Day to day will be repulsed thinking that I'm actually disrespecting the bonds that we have built that alllowed him to open up to me about his sexual desires, which he says no one other than his (very much demonized ex wife) and ex girlfriend know about him since they participated, instead of actually showing him my displeasure so that he will behave. It's clear in hindsight that he wants to submit to me, but I'm unsure of what his exact resistance to it is rooted in because he's so temperamental and I don't want him to disappear on me again. He says he's "just really insecure". Now that I've done some research after finding out what he really desired out of our friendship I see how out of self-loathing he's ashamed of,his desires and being vulnerable to only be rejected if he expressed them. I can see why he would refer to it as being really insecure, but I didn't know that until like 48'hrs ago. Now what?
I don't know if I should assume the dominant position now or just tell him that I'm we aren't compatible because I won't be dominated or controlled by him or any man for that matter. That's certainly the attitude I had when we met- Immdone with men, don't need em, don't want a relationship it sucks your soul with the preoccupation of the other person... That was my mantra for months after leaving my ex because of him because of his controlling nature. So obviously that's what attracted him. Hell, reading about BDSM I can see why he thought I was a potentials DOM, but I had no idea that was what I was doing by just being me talking to a friend. So, that's why your post resonated with me so much even though I agree it seems as you are male and I'm female that the challenges are different; I don't know how to go from vanilla-like '
M/F interaction to the roles of a D/s relationship, or if that's even what he wants if we aren't having a sexual interaction. When and how do I assert my dominance in the relationship if he's either unsure of my willingness and or ability to even handle take it as seriously as he does ( admittedly due to my ignorance and inexperience in entering into such an arrangement I've already screwed up left and right with being consistent) .
I know I could really get into being in control and all that entails within certain limits if we could,just establish the ground rules , and I'm still disinterested in any sort of search for another sub if he's not going to work out. I was so excited when I realized how this arrangement could benefit us both, and now I'm not even sure I'll get to play with him the way I want to because we can't get past the walls of vulnerability that exist in both of our public personas.
Can anyone who has more experience or knowledge of either male subs and how they really think, or on how to reign in my sub as the dominant personality in such a situation shed some light on his behavior or how I should respond to it to get him in line so we can both get what we want from each other[/]

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Awesomeffect

Kink Talk Member
  • Lesbian
  • Female
  • Switch
Dec 10, 2013
78
5
0
Thanks for the reply, yes, i see myself as a gentleman, there are some things i just don't do, like for example i would never call my sub things like bitch or whore, i much prefer stuff like slave or little one. I would also never raise my voice, i naturally have rather strong voice (or so they tell me) but i don't yell. As fr rebellious thing, i am rather the opposite, i would like a sub to always submit on her own, that extends to even the simple stuff like bondage and gagging, i enjoy giving orders so in a session would for example tell my sub to put her arms together and extend them so i can tie them up, open her mouth to receive a gag, stuff like that make me really excited, i am not into breaking anyone's will, submission should be a gift freely given.

I don't have so much time right now but i will just add that my screen name was not picked at random, old gods always represented certain ideals and i liked the ideal represented by god Mars (who was unlike the rest of roman pantheon very different from his Greek counterpart).


mmm I'll clarify one more thing here about my style it isn't that I like to break their will as that implies some sort of force or coercion has to take place. Instead I'd say at most I give them a little push here and nudge there sort of thing, or in other words I take someone who is interested in being a sub and help that interest bloom and blossom into a full out fetish or obsession. Also I'd like to say that though I understand what you mean when you describe what you like I'd say that personally for me that sounds fun for about the length of one session, if a sub doesn't grow and develop along with my relationship with her... well then she'd get boring real fast... at least for me anyway. Also that sounds like what you want is some imaginary perfect sub who will always be courteous and think of how best to please her master while always being obediently submissive... such a person though I won't say they don't exist is at best 1 in a 1,000,000. Perhaps this is one of your difficulties, you are attempting to find an ideal sub instead of just a sub.
 

Mars1991

Kinky Newbie
  • Straight
  • Male
  • Dominant
Jan 14, 2017
13
0
0
mmm I'll clarify one more thing here about my style it isn't that I like to break their will as that implies some sort of force or coercion has to take place. Instead I'd say at most I give them a little push here and nudge there sort of thing, or in other words I take someone who is interested in being a sub and help that interest bloom and blossom into a full out fetish or obsession. Also I'd like to say that though I understand what you mean when you describe what you like I'd say that personally for me that sounds fun for about the length of one session, if a sub doesn't grow and develop along with my relationship with her... well then she'd get boring real fast... at least for me anyway. Also that sounds like what you want is some imaginary perfect sub who will always be courteous and think of how best to please her master while always being obediently submissive... such a person though I won't say they don't exist is at best 1 in a 1,000,000. Perhaps this is one of your difficulties, you are attempting to find an ideal sub instead of just a sub.

Thats not it at all, i just want a sub that will trust me to lead, about the pleasing thing, this is where we diverge greatly, i do not hold my sub responsible for my pleasure.

Let me go on a tangent here and talk about something i was meaning to bring up but there was no opportunity as of yet, there was a time about 3 to 4 years ago when i was big into PUA stuff, and this is interesting because for those who were not in it basically it is distilled version of BDSM watered down enough so that vanilla people could swallow it, many of the founders were themselves into BDSM and they took out most of the kinky stuff (though some remained for those who can see it). But one sentence that got stuck in my head from that time is this "Abusive man demands respect, dominant man commands respect".

That is what i meant when i said i thought Ff and Fm relationships differed from Mf, in Mf IMO there is still a residue of that traditional relationship, and i know this to be true from the various blogs and ads i ran across, that many female subs who seek male doms want this element of safety that comes with it, they want a dom who's strength of personality is so great he gets her to submit to him without even trying.

Of course this is for the most part just an act, nobody can maintain this sort of presence indefinitely but one can work towards it.

And let me be clear too that i don't seek some emotionless doll, just the opposite, my goal is to allow my sub to experience full range of emotions, with me acting as a sort of safe harbor, a solid rock for her to hold on to, this i see as very important since such strong emotions can be overwhelming.

I also don't expect us to get there overnight, i am sure it will take a long time for my sub to trust me enough to relax completely in my presence, i read some time ago that for most women it is impossible to achieve orgasm if they are not relaxed, and that is what i want, i want to be able to make my sub cum at my command, i want her to feel my every touch like fire, that is my goal. Is that realistic or not, IDK, but that is what i strive for.
 

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