What to do about fakes?

[Doctor Pervert]

Now this got touched on in my other post "What happened to the Kink Talk" but for those that couldn't read that much here it is;

Fakes and catfish. This is very problematic for us as it isn't specifically prohibited by the board rules. This has been debated here and many places and the big issue is many consider it to be a form of "role play", I do not agree with this simply because if it is role play then be honest about what you're doing so the other party knows you are not who you say you are. The most effective way to combat these pests is by calling them out in their posts. If their activity is malicious or causing problems we will act on reports and ban them.

So personally I am more than happy to seeing public naming and shaming of any fakes, after all this isnt a democracy!
There have been several recent fakes reported to me but I will leave it to the accusers to state their proof here. And if the accused feel they have been wronged this is also the place to clear your name.

Let the slander begin!

 

[DeedeeDay]

I may be showing my ignorance here but what is catfish ?

 

[Doctor Pervert]

I may be showing my ignorance here but what is catfish ?

Refers to a film of that name that deals with a woman pretending to be a young girl (12 I think?) in her online persona. It has become a generic term for someone with a fake online persona, usually quite elaborate in its detail.

 

[DeedeeDay]

Well I never knew that.

As mentioned above some consider it to be a form of role play, I never really thought of it like that and I guess it is a valid point to a degree. When people role play those playing the roles generally know the true id of the person. Take for instance the wife that goes to a bar and hooks up with a stranger how comes in sometime later. Outwardly that is what onlookers would see and is what the wife and stranger want them to see. They have to believe the onlookers think that way for them to get the greatest pleasure. Only the two people involved know the stranger is really her husband.

Some play this on-line, They both know the real identities or sex of the players but those looking on don't. I guess it is some sort of exhibitionism and their will be those that get their kicks in a voyeuristic way by watching it being played out. So there you have exhibitionism and voyeurism and I think both are defiantly Kinks.

One question is, is kinktalk the places to be playing these games and projecting them as real. I guess not. It might be fine for people to meet up here and go elsewhere to play and it is certainly, in my opinion, OK to have discussions about it on here.

The problem is when it is, for a better word dishonest. Meaning only one player knows the truth but that opens the can of worms further because you could argue that some people who are into mind games find it perfectly acceptable or indeed crave being lied to to make the scene work. So there you have another kink with mind games.

I think the best way for those that wish to engage in such mind games is to approach it by first doing their homework, look at your intend, for a better word, Victim, chat to them see how the land lies. Fare enough you can not come out and say “fancy playing a mind game” Even mentioning the words mind games would be enough to spoil the fun for both, but you can figure out if that person would be acceptable to being being treated in such a way. Lots of people list their likes and dislikes in their profile so check it out. If they have mind games in their likes then their fair game. It is a form of sadomasochistic play which again is a valid kink.

Of course all this good use of faking and dishonestly runs smack into the problem of the truly dishonest people that are out to con and spam and all the other annoying rubbish that seems to infest any site.

What can we do about that ? Change the rules maybe, but then when do dishonest people stick by the rules.

The most effective way to combat these pests is by calling them out in their posts. If their activity is malicious or causing problems we will act on reports and ban them.

I guess it is the only practical way forward, but only if their actives are malicious and causing a problem. I think then the first step should be for anyone should be to go to the mods and tell them.
I'm all in favour of a bit of public naming and shaming but in this context it in its self could be used maliciously by a trouble causer.

It is a fine line to tread and I think before anyone starts a web world war the first step should be go to the moderators, who do a fantastic job :buttkiss:, they have the power to ban if needed.

after all this isnt a democracy!

Good job too, what self respecting submissive wants to live in a democracy.

 

[Misspain07]

here is the newst

janeleeds, i emailed her she sent some pics, they are of a completely different girl then the one she has posted here, she could not do a simple task such as "wear the shortest skirt you own and only that, do a photo shoot for me" shes a fraud, grrrrrrr i hate the fakes here, they destory it for everyone

 

[DeedeeDay]

janeleeds, i emailed her she sent some pics, they are of a completely different girl then the one she has posted here, she could not do a simple task such as "wear the shortest skirt you own and only that, do a photo shoot for me" shes a fraud, grrrrrrr i hate the fakes here, they destory it for everyone

WOW!, I must remember never to make you mad at me Misspain.

 

[Doctor Pervert]

The fake can be particulalrly annoying when they specifically say they want and/or like exposure but then don't want to supply photos or supply obviously stolen photos taken from the web. This use of public domain photos can often be proven using simple reverse image seach on google etc.
Where this gets really malicious is when they are using the fake persona to expose photos stolen from an ex or perhaps found on some device. If this is suspected staff will immediately delete these images and ban the poster. And this is where potential "exposers" need to be careful, most places now have revenge porn laws and you personally (not the hosting website) could be charged if the victim wants to take it that far.

So what do you look for to protect yourself and check for fakes?
The first and quickest test is to get the person to supply a fresh photo with the standard handwritten note including the date. This doesnt need to show anything more than their hand, its usually pretty obvious to spot male or female hands. If they refuse or come up with excuses like "my camera is broken" then this is an immediate red flag.
A more general check is to look at the photos they do send or post, are they consistent size and quality, are they taken in the same or similar locations?
Photos that are always different rooms or place, different styles and sizes are more likely photos collected of similar looking people off the web.

Do you have any other tips for exposing fakes? Please share them with us here to help clean up the forums of fakes.

 

[piesocial]

Fakes are a real problem especially in the kink scene when surrounding online play.

It is absolutely non-consentual when someone tells you they are someone other than who they are, which is done on purpose specifically because you wouldn't be interested in them otherwise.

This is 99% of the time a dude pretending to be a "mistress" and it can often lead to more serious, or even criminal, acts. Relating to real life non-consentual blackmail scenarios or similar. In fact it's so common there is a website called scam survivors that deals almost exclusively with this phenomenon in order to support the people who fall prey to it.

You could say that the victim was just gullible and should have asked the "mistress" to picture verify. That can also be faked, and often faking the picture isn't even needed because it's pretty easy to say something along the lines of "there are a hundred other guys messaging me".

The intent of the catfish is at the very least exploitative when not outright malicious and should be completely shut down wherever found.

 

[Doctor Pervert]

It is absolutely non-consentual when someone tells you they are someone other than who they are, which is done on purpose specifically because you wouldn't be interested in them otherwise.

You raise some really valid points, I understand the blackmail issue is a real and very dangerous part of this. In these instances the fakes are totally malicious and criminals and should be reported to the authorities.

 

[Centurion01]

Since it isnt against the rules... perhaps the rules need changing...

If some one posts a advert stating they are something they are not issue a warning, 2nd offense a temp ban and a permanent mark on their profile for all to see - something like big red text shows on every post they do and on signature as a permanent feature, or theyre kinktalk rank as Fake/catfish. 3rd offense permanent ban.

If, some one wants to roleplay being a mistress, then let them make a post where there is no doubt they arent who they are pretending to be.

Eg, Mistress (rp) -rest of the title.
Or a sub forum just for role play adverts.

If you claimed to be something irl and arent then thats fraud, misrepresention and a criminal offence.
Why should here be any different..?


Edit- perhaps add a vote to this thread, A- change the rules B- keep as is

 

[Centurion01]

Do you have any other tips for exposing fakes? Please share them with us here to help clean up the forums of fakes.

When theres someone posting, new to kink - new profile. Yet have a kik thats way older than it should be.

I personally dont invest time now in people that arent willing to prove who/what they are.

I believe many other are the same, 1 of several reasons this site has gone down hill.

 

[Doctor Pervert]

Since it isnt against the rules... perhaps the rules need changing...

perhaps add a vote to this thread, A- change the rules B- keep as is

I like this idea, I think it could float. I will start a new thread with vote soon, although as mentioned just how we would police it might be a problem?

 

[Centurion01]

I like this idea, I think it could float. I will start a new thread with vote soon, although as mentioned just how we would police it might be a problem?

I guess the same way as is currently, trust at first, if then theres doubt report the person.

Then that reported person has a choice, proof- set by a staff member (picture like the verify me)
Or the discipline..

 

[Doctor Pervert]

Some play this on-line, They both know the real identities or sex of the players but those looking on don't. I guess it is some sort of exhibitionism and their will be those that get their kicks in a voyeuristic way by watching it being played out. So there you have exhibitionism and voyeurism and I think both are defiantly Kinks.

This reminds me of something that happened in another forum where it transpired that one guy had created 5 or 6 (at last count) different personas. He then played out the interaction between them on the forums discussing different topics and arguing with himself! It was so elaborate, each profile had a photo, full description in the bio etc and he was only caught out when he bragged out what he was doing to friend who then decided to find the forum and see what was happening. She contacted the admins about it (he had used her as one of his personas, photo and all) and had him shut down!

 

[DeedeeDay]

This reminds me of something that happened in another forum where it transpired that one guy had created 5 or 6 (at last count) different personas. He then played out the interaction between them on the forums discussing different topics and arguing with himself! It was so elaborate, each profile had a photo, full description in the bio etc and he was only caught out when he bragged out what he was doing to friend who then decided to find the forum and see what was happening. She contacted the admins about it (he had used her as one of his personas, photo and all) and had him shut down!

Some people can take things to extremes, I can not where he was getting a thrill from that. To me it's like sitting in the corner talking to yourself.

If someone is banned, what stops them from just opening another account?

Perhaps some form of sex verification is needed, it might help.

 

[Doctor Pervert]

If someone is banned, what stops them from just opening another account?

Perhaps some form of sex verification is needed, it might help.

Good point, in fact we had an odd instance a few years back now of a serial ban dodger, this was also a fake and the weirdest thing was they used a series of names based on the Facebook friends of the original name. Once we worked this out we knew immediately any new accounts as we just looked up the name!

We do have some backroom tools we use to keep track of ban dodgers and are usually quite effective at spotting them.

We actually do have a verification system for females, started some years back the thread has details and any female wanting to recieve a Verified status can apply there.
At the time it was deemed that the biggest issue was with males posing as females and this was the solution.

 

[DeedeeDay]

Not really an option if it was voulentry. If you want to clean up fakes you will have to have a sex verify on each account.by Perhaps a voulentry method for both sexs and then some mark shkwing they have been verified is displayed against their name when they post anywhere on the site.

 

[pioneer0799]

The issue seems to be mainly guys that pretend to be girls and yet it is going to be the girls that have to verify because of that, when it is not them (generally) causing the problems..... But I can't see any other way around it.

So if a verification system was brought in, both male and female should have to verify, not just females.

 

[Misspain07]

i verify first as a Mistress

Its guys that want freebies thats the problem, but i dont understand that as much free porn is posted now adays, its not hard to find exactly what you want, pretending to be a girl makes no sense? Why waste hours or days for one or two pics? It waste everyones time unless your that worthless that you cant type in google what you want to jerk off to? Anyway im done with my rant

 

[Doctor Pervert]

Well thanks to our new software the suggestion about verification as well as tagging accounts that are reported as fakes is now possible! Staff will work out some guidelines for how this will operate and make an announcement soon.